Hi From United States - Tulsa Oklahoma!


Name is Brian glad to join up.

I just recently took and passed my ICND1 (in last month)

I also just took the ICND2 on 8/27/2016. I did not pass the exam I made a 815 but needed an 825. I am rescheduled to take this coming Thursday 9/1/2016. I actually feel pretty confident in my understanding of most of the material though I took a bit to long on the test and had to guest some questions on a frame relay lab in order to finish the test with like a minute left.

Its not so much the material that slows me down at the way they frame questions. Sometimes it feels like need a degree in understanding what they are trying to ask me (about 20-30% of questions but enough to slow me down and throw me off).

I am a new network admin working mostly with Brocade/cisco but no mentors or people around me as I moved from the server side of IT into the networking as the network engineer left.

hoping to be able to get some questions answered here and be able to ask at least educational networking questions as I dont have much in the way of mentors or people to talk to about networking.

one question area I found that I was not 100% up on was OSPF DR/BDR election.

I knew most everything from the books about exstart state and router ID but when a question was put out to me where it had point-to-point links mixed in with regular Ethernet and it asked about which routers would be the DR and which the BDR I was a bit confused. I knew that DR and BDR was not used in point-to-point protocols and it was only used in broadcast and nbma type environments as well as using multicast but I found I was not positive if I needed to eliminated DR/BDR if they was a router that had a P2P connection.

I made a guess and eliminated those routers saying they could not be DR/BDR even though they had a higher Router-ID.

I know each broadcast domain has its own DR/BDR so I was thinking I may have made a mistake because I started wondering if the router connected to a P2P had an interface in another broadcast domain.

however, the only information given was the router ID and the connection type such as ethernet or P2P. (so basically a bunch of circles showing a line representing ethernet or a line representing serial and the router ID. I knew they were trying to be tricky so I just didn’t pick the highest router-ID as I thought they were trying to throw me off with the P2P)

Anyway I found this link on your site and hopefully it will answer my question if not I may come back because I want to have the small details to understand that question. in the past I probably have read enough that it might be expected to put everything together for that question but I never made that leap of understanding I guess.


in case the picture did now show here is direct link

Also what does this mean:

"Something you need to be aware of is that the DR/BDR election is per multi-access segment…not per area!). "

is a multi-access segment a broadcast domain just another word for it?

Hi Brian,

Welcome aboard!

I’m sure you will pass the ICND2 exam next time since you got so close this time. The questions on Cisco exams can be a bit cryptic, they often try to throw you offguard…they should have some more straight-on questions that check if you know something or not.

About the DR/BDR, something to keep in mind is that we do an election for each multi-access segment. Multi-access and broadcast domain are often used to refer to the same thing but they are not :slight_smile:

For example, a frame-relay network can be multi-access but it doesn’t do any broadcasting. Ethernet is also multi-access but it does allow broadcasting. So when it comes to OSPF, remember that we do a DR/BDR election for each “multi access” segment…whether it can do broadcasting or not doesn’t matter.

Also, be aware that a line between two routers doesn’t automatically mean that this is a point-to-point link. If these routers are connected with Ethernet then it is a multi-access network. OSPF will check the interface and automatically assigns a network type:

CE1#show ip ospf interface GigabitEthernet 0/1
GigabitEthernet0/1 is up, line protocol is up 
  Internet Address, Area 0, Attached via Network Statement
  Process ID 1, Router ID, Network Type BROADCAST, Cost: 1

You can change this of course but by default, OSPF will do an DR/BDR election since the network type is BROADCAST.

Once you know where the DR/BDR election occurs, check the router IDs and priority for each router to tell which one will be DR or BDR.

I hope this helps!


Thank you.

I was thinking of Broadcast as a multi access. However, as its name implies its only “broadcast” which is an Ethernet technology that uses “my mistake!”

They are similar it seems but one is only for what its name implies “Broadcast” and the other is for all types of technology so is just called Multi access" (Also what its name replies)

So I think I understand now I just have to take their names literally but for all intents and purposes they function the same way, but for communicating I need to make sure I use correct terminology so others understand me.

Thanks for clearing that up for me.

the jagged line was suppose to be P2P and the straight line suppose to represent Ethernet in the little diagram I drew.

Does P2P break up a multi access network? or can you have multiple P2P all in same subnet and thus same multi access network. If I am asking something silly I apologize. I am just trying to push and at the boundaries of my knowledge so I understand its limits and rules completely.

I think if I go back to very simple rules like routers break up broadcast “in Ethernet” its probably safe to say that routers break up multi access networks to? that was the first rule I learned about routers was that they break up broadcast domains and switches break up collision domains.

So I may have just answered my own question by using a very basic rule but just looking for confirmation. =)

I think I am over thinking the relationship between multi access network and broadcast because I routers once again router specifically by default break up “Broadcast” domains and I cannot completely compare multi access to broadcast as routers do not route the broadcast packet by default. which could be different from multi access depending on what is being used as multi access is a broader term. So I was kind of making the same mistake as previously by lumping completely together.

sorry about that.

Hi Brian,

Multi-access and broadcast are two things that a lot of people mix up. Many students think it’s one and the same thing. You now know the difference so you are good to go :slight_smile:

P2P is usually just what it is…point-to-point. We assign a single subnet to each P2P link. There are some weird exceptions though. For example, it is possible to combine multiple point-to-point PPP links into PPP multilink. This is a logical interface where we still use one subnet but underneath, there are multiple P2P links.

Multi access basically means that we could have more than two devices on the same segment. With point-to-point, there’s only one device on the other end.

When you have two routers that are connected to each with other with an Ethernet cable then it looks like a point-to-point link but in reality, Ethernet is multi-access. You could add a switch in between and a third router would be in the same segment. With point-to-point serial links where you use HDLC or PPP, this is impossible…there’s only 1 device on the other end.


Thanks Rene,

I think I am now clear on this the conversation has been helpful!

Hi Rene,

I think this is my last CCNA question but I did have a couple of easy CCNP questions.

  1. what do I study first ((answered)I searched your sight to answer this question so I didn’t bother you and I found the answer, as you suggest the CCNP route first https://networklessons.com/personal-development/how-to-prepare-for-cisco-ccnp-rs/ )

  2. about equipment for lab? I also read your link here https://networklessons.com/cisco/ccnp-switch/cisco-ccnp-switch-lab-equipment/ it speaks about real equipment but had an update to CISCO VIRL. I currently have my own rack system with HP ProLiant DL360p with 4TB and is running VMware 5.5 and on that I have setup CISCO VIRL. I do have real equipment but to be honest it now sits in a pile and I use a combination of CISCO VIRL and GNS3. Cisco VIRL is cool but the Linux servers drives me nuts so I use GNS3 when I don’t need switch stuff. I do have GNS3 router setup with a switch module but I don’t like it so I use CISCO VIRL for my switching stuff. In addition, CISCO VIRL is the new IOS 15.+ images.

I work with real equipment on the job and so I am familiar with real equipment so I don’t need to touch for that reason. So is it fine to use CISCO VIRL for Switching lab or would I miss something?

It sounds like CISCO VIRL does it all switching wise now, and having real equipment is better for people that don’t use real equipment much as it gets them familiar with it but I just wanted to double check as that was not quite clear on the web link.

Hi Brian,

Unfortunately, Cisco VIRL doesn’t do everything you might need in Switching. One example of this is private VLANs. Additionally, there are a few topics where it appears as though the commands needed in VIRL are there, but the results just don’t work right. This is particularly unfortunate for someone studying, because you never want to be in the position where you are asking, when something isn’t working right, “is the problem me or is it a VIRL limitation?”

To solve this problem, I recommend (as does Rene) that you use rack rentals. If you combine rack rentals with workbooks that are meant to accompany the rental, it is super easy to jump in and just start working through exercises. Personally, I use INE for my CCIE studies. Here is a link to the workbooks they have for CCNP R&S

Here is a link to their rack rentals (the CCNA/CCNP track costs 3 tokens/hour):

FYI: A few times a year (particularly around Cyber Monday) they have a killer 2 for 1 token deal. I would recommend that you start your CCNP studies with Route so you have more time to wait for a good token sale to go on for the Switch portion. GNS3 and VIRL are perfect for Route studies.


I guess its fate. I had bought 3000 tokens first of the year and was going to use it for CCNA and CCNP but forgot I had bought them so that will come in handy. It makes me feel better than someone else with experience recommended INE as well.

So I will use that for my switching when time comes. Thanks for posting as that makes me feel better as I did not waste my money on those tokens.

oops I only had 494 tokens I guess I had bought 500 not 3000 big difference lol… hopefully enough though but I guess more is available if needed.

They sure seem to go fast! I would still keep an eye out for their 2:1 sale. As a matter of fact, I thought about you yesterday when I logged into my INE account and noticed they are running a Member’s Only promo of 50% off rack rental tokens.

You should see the promo when you log into INE, but just in case you don’t here’s the URL

I had taken my ICND2 another time but got sick(non test related) and did poorly but I sucked it up and went in for the third attempt.

scored the following:

LAN Switching Technologies–91%
IP Routing Technologies------100%
IP Services------------------100%
WAN Technologies-------------88%

I have been after this for like 6 years. I started out took the CCNA and failed and then came back took the ICND1 and passed it first time. I then got hired but on the server side. I worked for almost 4 years with the company and our network engineer quit and I got to start working with networking which is my first love.

I then went took the ICND1 and had horrible luck and had to take the darn thing like three times before passing each time I only missed it by like a question it pretty much sucked.

Then I started in on the ICND2 which I had never passed. So it was a pretty big deal for me. I am taking the night off and then I will start in on the CCNP and start with the routing. I am very excited about finally being a CCNA and I look forward to being a CCNP.

I found out about software called the BOSON software and that is what I used on the last test its great. they hvae a few questions that are mistake ridden but over all its a tool for success and I just hope their CCNP testing software is as good as their CCNA.

anyway all I can say is WOOHOO! Praise god!

oh 960 was the full score. I think that is pretty decent.

Congrats! A long, tough journey, but your score proves you are the boss!

I had purchased Boson product (NetSim), and it was a waste of money for me. Their study tools might be different, but I would avoid NetSim–it has the classic problem of “did I do this wrong, or is this a product limitation?”

Thank you Andrew!

I agree I didn’t like the Boson netsim though I only had the version that came free with a book I had purchased.

the CCNA testing software was really good except for like 3 problems that were horribly wrong. However, I can overlook those problems because over all it was a huge help and prepared me for the problems I saw on the CCNA. It may suck for CCNP I don’t know but I spent 300.00 on two failed test before I locked it down on the third attempt.

so paying 50-100 dollars for some testing software that can help raise a score by 50-100 points is seems to me to have high reward low risk. Worse case the CCNP testing is not as good. Best case I pass on first attempt and save some money. Either way I am stubborn and I will pass even if I have to take it until I do.

Any words of wisdom in regards to study material for the CCNP?

I have the following so far:

  1. CBT Nuggets
  2. this website
  3. Chris Bryants CCNP Route and CCNP Switching kindle editions (like 10 bucks apiece)

===========thinking about the ones below after I finish up on the ones above============

I was thinking about buying the INE CCNP V2 series for like 199.00

I was looking for one of those super detailed very boring very tech hardback copy of CCNP but so far not a lot of luck finding one of those. Maybe the Chris Bryant will be very detailed but they seem a bit more on the easy to read type than the super serious boring detail type. However, unsure yet as I am only a few pages in and its just review do far.

Safari online books have a crap ton of books and videos so it might be a good supplementation for books its not really a hard copy but you have a a lot of books and videos so you can check against each other its about 39.00 a month but might save something that for the end of your studies and use it the last couple of months for fine tunning. duno but does not sound bad.